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Logic 9 All Notes Off - Stuck Midi Note

Discussion in 'Logic 9' started by Cris is Bliss, Dec 27, 2011.

  1. Cris is Bliss

    Cris is Bliss New Member

    Is there a key commend for turning all notes off when you have a stuck midi note, if not, in which menu is the All Notes Off located.

    The way that I have been doing it, is to disable the software instrument and re-enabling it. But I know there has to be a different way.

  3. Peter Ostry

    Peter Ostry Administrator Staff Member

    Doubleclick the MIDI out field in the transport bar.
  4. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    If you are interested I can provide a small Macro tool where you can assign a custom Key switch or Control Change number to send "All notes Off" from your external controller. By the way CC# 120-127 are broken in Logic and the well known CC121 (all notes off) does not work for that reason.
  5. Peter Ostry

    Peter Ostry Administrator Staff Member

    These CCs are not broken in Logic. They just don't do much because they are seldom implemented in the software instruments. This applies to both, Logic and third party instruments.

    CC121 is "all sounds off", you certainly mean CC123 "all notes off". It does work for several software instruments but not for all. Again, this applies to Logic and third party instruments. For some third party synths CC123 works on Windows, not in Logic. This may be a fault in the particular AU versions, I don't know.

    But you are basically right. CC123 is not a reliable way to turn all notes off. The only generic and 100% reliable way I found is to send all 1024 note-offs on all 16 channels to all instrument channel strips. That's a lot of course but it works if we use it just for a kind of panic function.
  6. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    Yes I meant CC123 - thanks for the clarification Peter ! You are right, I remember in my last Logic 5 version (I used in my PC) CC123 was working with software instruments. There was some Project setting "Software Instruments use midi Controller as Standard Midi Controls" and CC123 was working in that mode as far as I remember - so it seems to be Logic version feature which disappear in the later versions...

    Regarding sending 2048 note OFF messages on the all 16th midi channels takes 3-4sec. I have created some Macro for other purpose but need time to find it and redesign...
  7. Cris is Bliss

    Cris is Bliss New Member

    Thank you for the feedback. I would be interested int your Macro for the all notes off and the all sounds off (Panic Button). I just need to learn how to use Macros.
  8. Peter Ostry

    Peter Ostry Administrator Staff Member

    Macros are explained in the Logic manual. But a macro just packs a whole patch into one object. You don't need a macro if you just want a simple panic function. For the function itself you need only a SysEx button and a transformer:

    Create a SysEx button that sends CCs 0-127 with value 0 on all channels. This makes 128 x 16 = 2048 lines and if you have a little practice working with the list of such a button it is basically a matter of copy/paste.

    Put a transformer after the SysEx button that converts Control Change to Notes. Since all CC values are zero, you will get note-offs for notes 0-127 on 16 channels. This is what you want.

    Note: You will cable the patch to channelstrips. Remember not to draw hundreds of lines because you may run into the "cable limit" problem. Make the cabling as efficient as possible.

    Of course there are more elegant and more complicated ways to generate the note-offs. But for an "emergency" button the function above does the job.
  9. Peter Ostry

    Peter Ostry Administrator Staff Member

    How do you send the messages?
    One SysEx button sends 2048 messages in about 0.5 seconds.
    (MacBook Pro 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo, Logic 9.1.6)
  10. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    Hi Peter,
    I just posted that as example - I have not mess up with thousands of messages sending from Sys fader but somehow I remember some time issues with "thousands messages" sent from a Sys.
    By the way you do not need a transformer after the the Sys fader. Instead of CC messages you can program 128 Note messages in the Sys fader, select All messages in the fader (Cmd+A) and close the fader dialog. Set the Fader as Button and set the button (fader range) to 0-0. Cause the range is 0-0 and the messages are selected when click the button it will send Note Offs. If you want to control the Sys fader using any external CC# you must set the external button values 0-0 as well.

    Regarding the Macro. It can be constructed in the same principle using Sys fader but it can have extra control parameters like - Note Key Switch assigner box where you can assign any KS and use it for external quick "Panic". The Macro can have a CC# assignment box for using external panic CC# etc. Another extra can be a midi channel assignment box. I.e it is not needed to send 2048 Off messages if you use say a controller set to ch.1. In this scenario the Macro midi channel "text" menu can offer to choose ch1-16 or ch.All. In channel "All" it will allow sending of 2048 messages only in the other modes it will send 128 messages. "Midi Channel" Auto guessing can be programed in the Macro as well.
    Another interesting method of programing is to create a table for all current playing Note ONs. The idea is if there are any "hanging" note ON(s) the table will register them so when you hit the KS or CC# external panic command the Macro will send one or a few Note OFF(s) to the hanging notes registered in the table etc. If I have some time can tweak with that next week.
  11. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    Hi Cris,

    I had some time to make a Macro tool named "Panic Tool". As I mentioned in my previous post I wanted to design some extra features for easy control etc.

    Panic Tool v1.0 Quick Guide

    The tool is patched between the Physical Input and the Sequencer in the Click & Ports Environment layer. Screenset #9 retrieves the tool as small float pallete in the Arrange. A stand alone Environment layer labeled "Panic Tool" offers a copy of the tool so you can easily import that tool into other song projects.

    Elements Description (see the image below).

    1. The CC# box.Here you assign any CC number (ch.any) to remote the "Panic" red button externally.
    2. The Panic button. You can mouse click it to send Note OFF messages (according to the bottom menu settings) or you can use remote Control number message (set in the CC# box) or note key # switching set in the "KS" box.
    3. The KS box. Here you assign a non-used note number (usually very Lo or Hi depending on your external keyboard).
    4. The Mode menu. There are two modes - "Normal" and "Smart".
    • The Normal Mode. In this mode the Panic button sends 128 (channel messages) if the "Out ch." menu is set to single channel 1,2,3 ...16 (see below). If the "Out ch." menu is set to "Ch.All" as shown then the Panic will send 2048 messages (most secure mode).

    • The Smart Mode. This mode optimizes the Note OFF message amount sending. The mode registers the incoming Note ONs and send Note OFF(s) to the currently playing notes only (hanging ones if any) depending on the "Out Ch." box settings (see below). Some hardware midi devices may interrupt during sending huge amount of midi messages, so the "Smart" mode is recommended with such devices. As an example the "hanging" notes are caused by some third party midi utility applications, bad midi cables and connections, keyboard damaged keys etc. In such scenarios the "Smart" mode will register the errors and will send proper Note OFFs to the hanging note numbers only.

    5. The Out ch. menu. This flip menu offers single output channel assignment 1,2,3,4 ...16. It is supposed that you use a keyboard set to global midi channel 1. In this scenario you can set the "Out ch." menu to ch.1, so when hit Panic only 128 messages will be sent to ch.1 if the "Mode" is set to "Normal" or the Panic will send just a few Note OFF(s) if the mode is set to "Smart".
    If you want to send 2048 note OFF messages (most secure mode) you can choose "Ch.All" as shown in the image below (to send 2048 messages you need to set the "Mode" menu to "Normal"). If the Mode menu is set to "Smart" and the "Out ch" to "Ch.All" and you play and hold C3 for example, after hitting Panic the tool will send sixteen Note OFF messages to channels 1-16.

    Panic Tool v1.0 -DOWNLOAD

  12. smoove

    smoove New Member

    Hi Tangra,

    This is really great. Specially the SMART mode. I'm really impressed. Added that to a project and worked nicely with EXS 24.

    I have a question, though: can it work without a non-used note and use a foot pedal instead? Here's the reason: other than this keyboard (which I mentioned in the other post), I mostly use a guitar-to-midi controller, which outputs notes on channels 1-6, 11-16, and I have a drum sequencer that I assign to channel 7. I can't trigger a non-used note, as I use the entire fretboard of the guitar. So I have a custom built floorboard, with 2 Roland hold pedals, and 2 expression pedals. I use the hold ones to move program up/down, send specific messages, tap tempo, etc. That's what I use to stop the drum sequencer/looper and the notes on hold. To make it work, the technician who built it could not implement a table of notes--such as your SMART mode--so it only sends AllNotesOff messages... :|

    Is there a way this message could be transmitted to EXS24 and the other instruments in Logic?

    I don't want you to have the trouble of programming a macro or anything (unless you really want to do so--I don't like to give people trouble or work). Perhaps if you could please share the principle or the steps I need to take, I'd be happy to build it myself and share with the forum.


  13. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    Hi guy,
    If I understand correctly it means that the technicians developed some kind of Monophonic mode so you can play in monophonic mode only ?
    If yes, it is not hard for me to develop a Note ON registry scheme and transform the CC123 into a real Note OFF ID which will match the Note ON ID number.

    The other scenario is if your device plays polyphonic (chords etc) and in the moment you want to make a note OFF it sends a global CC123. In that case you kill all notes (Chord etc) ? What I can do is to demix the incoming polyphony using some extra schemes like my "Polyphonic Channelizer" tool - have a look and try a free Demo of it here.
    I need more info about your custom gear.
    It will be nice if you can provide a Standard Midi File (SMF) using some other DAW which can record the incoming CC123 messages with the note information you play using that gear.
  14. smoove

    smoove New Member


    The tech guy who built my floor board unfortunately has passed... He used the projects and diagrams from Midibox. I have no idea what's in it... Also, it has been malfunctioning since someone poured beer on it on a gig, so I may have to revert to the FCB1010...

    To answer your questions:

    a. It plays both monophonically or polyphonicaly, it's switchable;

    b. Yes, it sends AllNotesOff messages in all 16 channels (actually 32, since it has 2 ports);

    Wow, that's a lot to my poor little brain! Could you explain what that does in more detail? What is a "registry scheme?"

    Will try your channelizer and report back to you.

    Thanks so much for your help.

    Mike (smoove)
  15. smoove

    smoove New Member

    PS> Can you suggest me a DAW that will record the incoming midi data without filtering anything? Free is better, but I can dish some money in, since that would help me quite a lot.

    Everything I use (Logic, Live, Cubase) will filter something...
  16. Tangra

    Tangra Senior member

    You can use both Live or Cubase and export a SMF of the recorded sequence.
    The Logic sequencer has a bug and can not record CC120-127 according my Part 1 topic - Using Control Changes (CC#120-127) - as Performance.

    BTW. I just posted the new Recording (CC120-127) Workaround Part 2, so download the provided Logic song template provided at the bottom of that topic and send me the Logic song file with your recorded sequence - note events + CC123 tweaking. (It will be recorded as CC113 in the new template so I can have an idea what is going on).
  17. Peter Ostry

    Peter Ostry Administrator Staff Member

    Mmmh ...

    Although Tangra's environment work is very interesting, as long as we talk about "all-notes-off" Logic provides a simple way to shut sounds off.

    We know that doubleclicking the MIDI field in the transport bar acts as a panic function. This is also available as a key command and of course you can assign a MIDI message. Just search for the word panic in the key Commands window and assign what you want:
    I have not fully checked the behavior MIDI-wise but it seems to work well for internal and external synths. See the Logic PDF manual, search for the word panic. The manual does not tell everything but mentions the various methods.

    There is one thing I do not like in my particular setup: The Logic panic function sends note-off for all notes on all channels to every available port. This would disturb my hardware synth and probably a running Max application while I just want to kill a hanging note of a software synth in Logic.

    As a side note:
    The problem with incoming external CC123 would not be completely solved if the sequencer would not filter it. The CC would just go to the selected track which isn't enough in many cases.

    To shut off specific instruments we have to cable directly to channelstrips and – if necessary – to specific MIDI ports.

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