ability to import songs written before Logic 7

#1
I have many songs written in Logic 4 and 5 (some even earlier). It's a shame to have to keep a copy of Logic 7 on my Mac for the sole purpose of importing pre-7 song versions.
 

Orren Merton

Logic Samurai / Administrator
Staff member
#2
I have many songs written in Logic 4 and 5 (some even earlier). It's a shame to have to keep a copy of Logic 7 on my Mac for the sole purpose of importing pre-7 song versions.
I agree, it is a shame, but sadly, that's often the way the world goes. Cubase 4 isn't compatible with older Cubase songs, etc. Very often, enhancements means a new file format that is incompatible with the old format.

It would be nice if they came up with an input filter for importing old songs, but Cubase, etc. haven't, so I'm guessing this just isn't a priority.

Orren
 

Pete Thomas

Administrator
Staff member
#4
I think there just comes a point at which they have to choose between backwards compatability and the actual ability for new developments take place. I'm totally with you on this, I wish I didn't have to keep Logic 7 around but I do think that if it had been a priority to keep the ability to import those older version files then Logic 8 wouldn't be so radically different/better (take your pick!). I just dread the point at which Logic 7 no longer works on the latest Macs. I'll just have to go through the archives and convert while I still can
 
#6
I just read in the FAQ article that Logic 8 is supposed to import Logic 5, 6, and 7 song files. I thought it was restricted to importing Logic 7 files. I can live with it if it goes back as far at 5. But I thought I'd had trouble with that when 8 first came out. Can anyone clarify this issue (in other words have you tried to import a Logic 5 or 6 song into 8 successfully)?
 

Orren Merton

Logic Samurai / Administrator
Staff member
#7
I just read in the FAQ article that Logic 8 is supposed to import Logic 5, 6, and 7 song files. I thought it was restricted to importing Logic 7 files. I can live with it if it goes back as far at 5. But I thought I'd had trouble with that when 8 first came out. Can anyone clarify this issue (in other words have you tried to import a Logic 5 or 6 song into 8 successfully)?
I've not tried Logic 5, but I've definitely imported Logic 6 songs successfully.

Orren
 
#10
The more I think about this, the more it ticks me off. The reason Emagic was able to import all earlier versions before Apple took over is because they would recycle their old import code. If you imported a Logic 4 file, you would see a series of dialog windows as it converted from one version to another until it opened in the current version. Why couldn't this trend continue? If Logic 8 can open a Logic 5 song, then they could have kept the code that updated a 2, 3 or 4 to a Logic 5 format. The only reason I can think of for not doing this is whether or not they had to change the code for Intel, but I doubt that because Emagic had no problem maintaining this code in the jump from Mac OS 9 to OS X, which I dare say is a much bigger jump. The omission of this longtime Emagic standard is a blow to producers who have been using Logic since version 2 or earlier (I started at 2.5). Many of us have ideas we will eventually revisit in early versions.

I've heard some good attitudes in defense of apple on this thread, and I almost agree with some of them. But the more I think about it, the more it seems like a lame excuse from Apple (I still love ya though). Emagic had worse obstacles in the move to OSX, and they maintained importing of all versions without blinking.
 
#11
You can import older songs but you have to open that with a logic version then re-save.
If i'm not rememebring wrong you have to open with tha latest 6.x version, then save again, after that you can open it with 7 and 8 aswell
Never tried but i remember some updates notes that was talking about it
 
#12
Looking at the early part of this thread, you'll see this is well known. The issue is that we don't want to have to keep a copy of Logic 7 (which can open all previous versions) just to do this task when Apple could have maintained the same code that was in Logic 7 in order to import the earliest versions.
 

Markdvc

Administrator
Staff member
#13
First of all, I fully agree with alienimplant that it is regrettable that we cannot access older songs in logic 8. However, I can understand that as there have been so many "under the hood" changes to logic's code over the years:

Logic 4 - OS9 and Win 95/98, Logic 4.8 Win 2000.

Logic 5.4 - first OSX version, no more AU support
Logic 6 - last OS9 Version (still with VST support)
Logic 7 first OSX only version, up until Logic 7.1.1, last PPC only version
Logic 7.2 - first UB version
Logic 8 - major re-write

that this issue was anything but trivial. Logic 8 was released in 2007, around 7 years after Logic 4. I assume that if it had been feasible, and perhaps if they had felt that enough users would have needed it, they would have done it.

While I always suggest sending feedback to Apple about this or any other issue, as time marches on and Logic 4 recedes into the past, I suspect that it is even less of a priority than it might have been, and yes, I wish that wasn't the case ...

kind regards

Mark Cahill
 
#14
Mark, thanks for your thoughts, but please understand my point. This code was already in Logic 7. Logic 8 doesn't have to directly open a Logic 4 song. Logic 7 didn't. 8 doesn't need to either. It worked by importing 2.5 to 4 to 5 or something like that. The changes in song formatting are irrelevant if the code to convert earlier versions to 5 is already in Logic 7. There would be no additional effort to include the Logic 7 code into 8 for importing the earlier versions.

The bottom line is, this is my wish, which is what this list is about. The omission of this ability at least feels like an excuse, but my impression is that it would be nothing more to maintain in 8 than it was in 7 due to the way that Emagic handled imports. I would be more understanding if I was asking for 8 to import a 2.5 song directly, but I'm not. There is no new coding here. And it is not difficult to implement. The code was simply discarded in the move to 8. It's not even an interface issue. There was no good reason to discard it. At least I haven't heard justification for it that makes any sense from a coding standpoint. If someone has direct knowledge about this, I'd be very glad to hear it, so I can put it to rest and shut my mouth.
 
#15
A real world example of the problem this causes in a commercial environment is when I'm setting up Logic environments in recording studios for outboard MIDI gear. Every client I've met with that is on Logic 8 no longer has 7 on their computer. So it's up to me and my trusty copy of Logic 7 to import Logic 4 environments that are all over the internet which I then locate, download and copy into the clients new environment (via my copy of Logic 7), to build the patch name lists for their Motif or whatever it is they want to have all stock patch names for.

By discarding the pre-5 import code, Logic has smacked Logic admins in the face and forced them to keep a copy of 7 on their machines indefinitely. If the wealth of Logic environments that still circulate the web were on the minds of Apple engineers, I doubt they would have dropped this code so quickly. I think the focus is on the their current growing market share, with little regard for the old timers who still get hired to set this stuff up at various studios. I have a right to be displeased with it.
 
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