Logic TDM Logic 9 TDM questions


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I'm running a 2011 mac pro, 10.6.6 o/s, and a Pro Tools HD2 running version 9 software.

I have a few potential clients who would like to book the studio, but they work on Logic systems. So, I've bought Logic Pro 9.

I've been trying to set it up - I've read the little blurb in the 'help' menu, which essentially tells me what some things do but not why you'd do them, and have come up stumped. Running with Core audio, (preferences/audio/devices/coreaudio), the system seems to run fine. I can play back the various logic 'songs' i've been given, and work away quite happily.

One thing I did notice was that in running core audio, I was restricted to only 8 I/O - is this normal?

I then tried record something, because while I know the clients won't be recording any bands, they might want to record a vocal or guitar. With the buffer set as low as I could, latency was very poor - unusably poor. Is this to be expected? I understand the signal flow through the TDM cards fine, so I can understand that routing the signal from the TDM cards off to the host based mixer and back will take time, but can it really be worse than say a USB or firewire interface? (apparently so in my case).

I've tried enabling the DAE tab in the aforementioned menu, but it doesn't seem to make much difference. Enabling direct TDM causes parts to stop playing back, and (what I would refer to as) sample and tick based tracks drift apart from each other - very disconcerting, and I have no real idea why...

Also, regardless of what box I have ticked, the mix engine still exists in the host computers CPU, yes? Logic cannot/does not transfer it's mixing and routing engine into the TDM chip when selecting DAE? If this is the case (that the mix engine exists inside the host CPU), is there a way of enabling direct monitoring, and somehow provide a low latency output to someones headphones?

So basically, if some fine Logic aficionado could explain and reassure me about the above I'd be so grateful. I just don't know what Logic should be able to do with Pro Tools hardware.
My understanding is that the most current version of Logic is no longer compatible with Pro Tools TDM hardware. But you can use the USB Digidesign stuff with Avid's CoreAudio driver. The Eleven Rack works fine with the current version of Logic.
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Well it does work... ? Haven't read anything that says it isn't compatible...

Currently I've swapped in my HD Native system, which works flawlessly (albeit, still with a maximum of 8 i/o).

Any further insight folks?

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From the ProTools read me:

Incompatibility of Apple Logic Pro 9 or MOTU Digital Performer Running as a DAE Client with Pro Tools HD 8.0.3 (Item #119902)
Due to unforeseen technical issues, the newly released Pro Tools 8.0.3 software will no longer support Apple Logic Audio or Mark of the Unicorn Digital Performer running in DAE mode. Attempting to play back will result in no audio output. Record- ing audio in Logic will yield the error "Saving spool file / Entry not in queue. Result code = -1." Users of both applications can still take advantage of Pro Tools CoreAudio drivers and use the Pro Tools HD system as hardware I/O. Pro Tools 8.0.1 will continue to be made available in its current form to Avid customers who are using Logic Audio or Digital Performer in DAE mode for the foreseeable future.

It is clearly the end for 3rd party DAE support from Avid, because nothing has changed in the past year or so.
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Logic has a menu in audio settings - in it are buttons to enable DAE (DIGIDESIGN audio engine), and direct TDM - both are direct references to Pro Tools hardware.

I don't think the above post has anything to do with the issue - Pro Tools HD cards have existed for over a decade, and have hardly changed (other than a switch from PCI to PCIe several years ago). "Users of both applications can still take advantage of Pro Tools CoreAudio drivers and use the Pro Tools HD system as hardware I/O."
In fact, Avids support for this coming together of Pro Tools hardware and Logic software is surely neither here nor there, since the cards are physical things.

Anyway, I move back to my original question - is the behaviour I described actually correct?

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enabling the DAE tab makes HUGE differences but in this case you have to disable core audio, working with dae inside logic gives same latency as pro-tools.
once core audio is disabled (aswell as the digidesign core audio driver on osx sound preferences) you have to create a new mixer audio track, that is "DAE" based.
Recording over this track will have low latency.
that kind of audio track has many limitations, one is that you can use only TDM plugs in it. The only way to communicate with standard core audio stuff in the same project is enabling the ESB, that gives you 8 outputs from DirectTDM(that is core audio based) to DAE.
In additions, it looks that this kind of support has been dropped by avid/digidesign.
I still can use it succesfully on my system but i'm on 10.5.8, with pro tools 8.0.1cs2 and logic 9.1.5.
I don't know exactly about 10.6.x and PT versions newer than 8.0.1, it may not work anymore...

i've never used digi cards as core audio i'm sorry, i don't know about latency.
but you may try the button "low latency mode" in logic while recording, maybe that's the cause of your delay...

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