• Welcome to Logic Users Group V2.0.4

    We have a few new features and changes See here

Logic TDM Must I always have two rigs?

I notice that this is the first post in this part of the forum - makes me wonder how many others are using this combination..?

For myself, I have a writing rig at home with a trusty ProSonus Firebox, and then there's the big HD2 setup at the studio. I run Pro Tools most of the time there, as it's primarily a recording studio, but several times a month I am obliged to resolve someone's problems with features that are only available to me in Logic, so I use that with the Digi hardware. When I do, I always feel like the child of parents who are about to divorce - everything is slightly more difficult because of the software and hardware's steadfast refusal to get along. If I want to use the softsynths in Logic, I have to use Core Audio instead of addressing TDM directly, and that extra layer seems to slow things down and create unexpected flakiness.

Are there others out there with the same experience, and has anyone found ways to make them behave better together? I look forward to hearing your responses!

Sonny Keyes
Ricochet Audio
A few people I know are abandoning TDM/Logic for anything-not-Digidesign/Logic. Those who don't have to use ProTools SOFTWARE that is.

Gone are the days that TDM was the only solution for seriously big DSP intensive projects. And now that CoreAudio+Logic has a lot more functionality than TDM+Logic, the choice is fairly obvious to some.

I don't know whether it's more Digi's or Apple's fault about this. If Logic could support HD hardware the way ProTools does (one big consolidated engine, native+TDM plugins together, direct hardware access etc..), it would once again become the ultimate software/hardware combo it once was.

But now we have two great systems that don't overlap in various features and thus not one "perfect" system:

ProTools+HD hardware.
Logic+great CoreAudio hardware (such as Apogee/Symphony).
That you, ferenc? Jeez, we're all Junior Members again!

Yes, I have now taken to writing tracks at home with the Firebox, printing mix stems and bringing them to the studio to mix in Pro Tools, which I find easier to use for mixing, probably just because I spend more time mixing on it, but it seems to sound better too. I'm so grateful that we now have 4GB data keys so I don't have to keep burning a CD every time I want to bring a session in to mix!
Yep, it's me. I'm not sure how to add a signature at the end of every post.

Even when TDM+Logic never crashes or glitches, the absence of various "native-only" features AND the dual engine concept is a big drag.

agreed. I'm tired of the workarounds and shortcomings of using the two together. I'm still in Logic 7.2.3 as 8 was extremely sluggish and unreliable for me under DAE but I think last week I was pushed over the edge. A guitar part that was panned right and bussed to an AUX just simply failed to sound. This happens sometimes when I start pushing the HD cards hard with plugs, etc...but usually it takes out an entire stereo channel so we notice it immediately. It was a simple background part so we didn't notice on the full mixes and I didn't catch it until the night before a 9AM mix when listening through the stems my assistant made. (bussing it straight to the main out fixed it) Anyway, I know we always have to keep our ears on for stuff like that no matter what the tool but its stuff like that bugs me...no error, nothing, just poof...

i started messing with 8 in purely native mode (with a 2408 mk3) last week after the incident and i have to say it felt pretty good. Even on my dual 2.7 G5 it was pretty snappy. I imagine a native L8 setup on a newer mac would be nice...i dropped the buffer to 64 and recorded some guitar through waves amp and it felt just fine. I opened up cue mix to monitor my Gigastudio PC and it didn't feel like too much of a headache...I would miss putting TDM plugs directly on a Gigastudio input but maybe with a new mac/apogee rig I could get away with having buffers low all the time...don't know. Will I notice a difference in sound quality? I'll report more as I experiment.