Teaser of things to come?

CSeye

Logician
I've seen this mentioned in a couple of thread out there on the wild web. But sure enough, a new menu item is available in v9.1.7 in the Arrange>View local menu>HyperDraw>Articulation ID

At this point, it disappears when a region is created.

Commentary :hippy: Logic 9.x does everything I need it to except for providing talent and inspired recordings.:D But seriously, it's at a stable, mature stage of development. There's plenty of wish list items, but no real gripes.

Having said that, it's really interesting that Steinberg seems to be the only DAW maker at this time that's pushing continued development of MIDI functionality with it's VST Expression, Note Expression, etc. Reaper, Studio One, etc seem to have very good audio editing functions but weak MIDI. If I only did audio or mostly audio projects I'd still be using DP (started with v4.5).

I really appreciate the MIDI tools and editors available in Logic, but VST Expression is an exciting frontier. As an old Cubase VST 32 user back in the day it's been kinda fun to work through various video tutorials for Cubase 6. Sort of like hedging my DAW options just in case...

It was be crazy good if the next major Logic upgrade were to also expand MIDI functionality by including some sort of articulation/note expression functionality to complement the Score editor.

So maybe this teaser menu item in v9.1.7 is a sign of things to come...
 

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Eli

Logician
This is PURE SPECULATION, but my guess would be that maybe this has to do with some sort of direct support of one or more third party developers. Like maybe VSL or PLAY? Maybe it's something designed to access features on those plug-ins. It wouldn't be the first time in Logic's history that they made an effort to support some sort of third party developer directly from within Logic.
 

CSeye

Logician
This is PURE SPECULATION, but my guess would be that maybe this has to do with some sort of direct support of one or more third party developers. Like maybe VSL or PLAY? Maybe it's something designed to access features on those plug-ins. It wouldn't be the first time in Logic's history that they made an effort to support some sort of third party developer directly from within Logic.


It's definitely a wait and see situation.

At this point, the suspense is starting to intensify...:D
 

CSeye

Logician
I just checked the Steinberg site: Chris Hein Instruments, and VSL provide VST Expression Maps.

My GPO4 also comes with expression maps.

Nothing to do but wait and see what Articulation ID is all about.
 

Doug Zangar

Logician
I just noticed this thread (I may be slow, but I'm expensive...) and checked out the menu item. The one project I opened to test had a wee bit more info (see attached image).

I've given up speculation about anything Apple, but if they do add this to 9.x or in the next major release, it could be a useful feature.

Cubase definitely has some MIDI related features that could inspire the Logic guys......
 

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CSeye

Logician
I just noticed this thread (I may be slow, but I'm expensive...) and checked out the menu item. The one project I opened to test had a wee bit more info (see attached image).
Perhaps you get more of a teaser from Apple because of your status as a Logic educator.:thmbup:

But on this end, things are getting kinda spooky. I revisited the Arrange>View local menu only to see that the Articulation ID item was no longer within the Hyperdraw submenu:confused:

On a whim, I entered articulation into the Key Commands search box. (see attached image). It must have been there all along (or was it???) but I didn't think to check previously.

Looked but couldn't find it in the Event window. But when I went back to the Arrange>View, the item was again in the HyperDraw submenu. (Theremin volume swell fades in... :eeek:)

Next, opened a recent project, but the item was not in the View>HyperDraw? It does consistently appear in the Key Commands>Event window.

I've given up speculation about anything Apple, but if they do add this to 9.x or in the next major release, it could be a useful feature.
Maybe Apple is being playful given the speculation surrounding the next upgrade.;)


Cubase definitely has some MIDI related features that could inspire the Logic guys......
Competition is good for end users. Hopefully Apple is taking note of Expression maps and such.
 

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Doug Zangar

Logician
Now you got me looking into this.... So I assigned a key command to the Articulation ID and it does show up in the event list (see image). Number range is 0 - 254.

The "now you see it now you don't" in Hyperdraw seems to be a function of if a project is just opened, or a new region is created. Haven't spent a lot of time on this, but it seems to hide itself once the region has some activity on it.
 

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CSeye

Logician
Yes indeed! The ID column appears in the Even List when using a key command. 0-254 here as well.

Regarding HyperDraw, you're right. Arctic ID is present when opening a new empty project.
 

Doug Zangar

Logician
Ok - I guess that means we're all set for implementation. Depending on how long Apple takes, I might have to review this thread to remember what we figured out....
 

Atlas

Logician
It was be crazy good if the next major Logic upgrade were to also expand MIDI functionality by including some sort of articulation/note expression functionality to complement the Score editor.
Isntit just "MIDI meaning" of the score articulations, which was already implemented in Logic? In fact this feature is dated since (former) Notator when it was running on the Atari, decades ago!
 

Doug Zangar

Logician
Logic has indeed had some basic MIDI note articulation available since Notator days. Other programs now additionally allow for dynamics to work. The note expression features CSeye speaks of I know are found in Cubase - pretty nice stuff, and Logic has nothing to compare to it.
 

Atlas

Logician
Logic has indeed had some basic MIDI note articulation available since Notator days. Other programs now additionally allow for dynamics to work. The note expression features CSeye speaks of I know are found in Cubase - pretty nice stuff, and Logic has nothing to compare to it.
Thanx for your feedback Doug!

However after reading and listening on Steinberg's website about the Cubase VST Expression feature, it seems that only their HALion4 plugin could actually make use of it effectively... And to be honest, after listening to the posted demo recordings, I remain unconvinced that one could not achieve similar results in Logic, albeit using a more elaborated (complicated) approach...
 

Doug Zangar

Logician
I did only use it with HALion, but I'm under the impression some other synths use it. Remember, this is a relatively new concept and it may take more time before plug-in manufacturers embrace it. However, Steinberg has created a standard the develops can use - think VST. It's now default.

Everything it does one can replicate with Logic but would require multiple tracks. Its elegance and ease of use make a it a very fast, so quite useful _if_ you use that type of feature set. I'm still using Logic as my DAW of choice.
 

CSeye

Logician
The HyperDraw>Articulation ID is still present after updating to L9.1.8.

Played around with it some more. Articulation IDs are listed in numerical order in the HyperDraw menu while their location can be variable as shown in the Event List. Selecting Any reveals all velocity-node like ID locations.

Selecting a specific ID number in the HyperDraw menu results in only that ID being visible.

Very interesting...
 

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CSeye

Logician
After entering some notes in the Piano roll, the key command for the Articulation ID was used to open up the ID column in the Event List. At that point, I just randomly click-dragged in the ID column for each note ...

Those ID values then appeared in the HyperDraw> menu.
 

CSeye

Logician
Nice demo. Now to get the feature to do something.....
No kidding.

More interesting but currently unusable bits of information:
- Once the ID column is created in the Event List by invoking the key command, it can be shown or hidden via the Event List View local menu.

- Articulation ID is also available in the HyperDraw pop up menu below the Piano Roll or Score Editor.

- If a MIDI region/loop already contains Expression or other controller data , the Articulation ID nodes will not be visible unless Note Velocity is first selected in the HyperDraw menu. Otherwise selecting a specific ID is represented in brackets after channel, Controller type in the upper left of the HyperDraw editor e.g. 1, 11,(23)

Bring it on! :hippy:
 
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